When we last saw Max…
Loyal readers may remember Max, a man who caused quite a stir some months with a story about standing up his date. You should read the piece here, because it’s awesome, but the long and the short of it is: Max discovered his date was far heavier than she claimed on her profile, so he stood her up. Skipped the date. No text, no nothing. You folks, as a whole, were not pleased. But that’s not where the story ended…
I got back in touch with Max recently as I was putting together my book, to see if he had any new adventures to offer. Unfortunately they didn’t make into the book (Not a Match: My True Tales of Online Dating Disasters, available in January for Kindles and Ipads! Plug Plug Plug Plug!), so I wanted to share them with you here. Because again, they’re amazing.
There was a time when I thought of Max as my alter-ego. We have the same powers, but I use mine for good, while he uses his for evil. He’s basically the Lex Luthor to my Superman, only I look terrible in tights and he’s not bald. But still–we have a similar approach. We both use first email templates, devote a lot of thought to finding the perfect first date bar, and accept that Internet dating is simply a numbers game. But, there are differences. Max charts his dating successes on a spreadsheet. He actively tries to get his dates drunk. And he is always prepared to sleep with a woman after the first date. Here’s what Max told me about his strategy for a first encounter:
“And our third bar is right around the corner here…”
For me, 3/4 of the battle [of every first date] is logistics. The one advantage that [men] have is that we can plan everything. So I do. EVERYTHING. You know that feeling that you’re just hitting it off and everything seems so perfect? Because I made it that way. Every date I take you on is designed to move you around and get you drunk, and trust me, the planning can get elaborate. Why move [to different locations]? To make it seem like more time has passed than really has. If we go to 5 or 6 places on our first date it feels more like our 5th or 6th date and thus I’m way less of a stranger– [so] you should probably sleep with me. I detail my apartment before I leave too, completely prepping it should I return with my date. I go so far as to unscrew certain light bulbs to create a ramp of mood lighting from my front door to my room. I have a playlist for whatever music you like ready to go, only it starts out lively and ramps as well to shape a mood. I have crepe batter or something ready to go in case I promised you food to get you here. At this point I know what to say and do that victory is eminent.
OK, I’m guessing at this point you hate him. The phrase “victory is eminent,” is tough to get behind, I agree. But here’s my question: is this actually sleazy? Is it Lex Luthor’s Guide to Romance and Intercourse, or does Max simply care a great deal about his date going well? Many women agonize over countless details: the right outfit, the proper earrings, the perfect amount of “Kiss Me Damn It” attitude–is Max really any different? I mean, I’ve had ladies email me pictures, asking which hairstyle tells a guy, “I want you, but maybe not until the second date.” (My answer every time: A mullett.) They comes off as sweet, if a little deranged, so could Max be in the same category?
Here’s how he begins the courting:
My first move is before we ever meet. I know you’re not a fan of IM, but I use it if I don’t yet have a phone number for texting. What I do is propose a game. When she asks what, fully expecting it to be some super cheesy line, I send her a Youtube link to a music video and say, “you find the next one.” Then I’d just DJ with her for a half hour or so. Often I’d be playing with multiple ladies at once and would just send their links to each other. It’s an easy game, gives you stuff to talk about, ladies seem to love it, and it can make a girl meet you for the first time with a totally different attitude.
You’re already turned on, aren’t you?
I gotta say, that’s pretty clever. What would you rather do: explain to someone exactly what your job in Human Relations and Data Resources entails, or find a funny John Cougar Mellencamp video to forward? Max’s DJ move breaks a conversation out of tedious small talk, and makes him memorable. The whole thing sounds pretty damn charming, if he weren’t resending the videos to other women he was simultaneously wooing in this theoretically spontaneous fashion. Scoundrel or simply resourceful? I still can’t decide.
Let’s see how Max handles the most romantic of all endeavors, the first kiss:
I only had one venue for first dates, and it was chosen for the stairs. I’ll explain. On a first date, I’m looking to get the first kiss over with as soon as possible which is quite challenging. Conventional wisdom would have you kiss her at the door right before you leave, but that’s [not for me]. So these stairs are significant because they are a chance to shatter the physical barrier. I realize how stupid that sounds, but I swear by it. I would always wait outside the bar and would leave the “I’m here” texting to her. When I greeted her I’d always opt for the hug, then right after the hug we’d tackle the stairs, which didn’t have a railing and so were a tactical device for holding her hand thinly veiled in chivalry. I’m now 10 seconds into my date and look at all I’ve accomplished. I’m now a 10% ABV pint and a story about robots or something away from a mid-date first kiss.
I’m sure you women out there are shocked and awed, yelling, “See! This is why guys are the worst!” And we are. If we’d just walked through the Sahara desert and had the choice of either drinking a bottle of water or getting a framed photograph of Jennifer Love Hewitt’s boobs, we’d go JLH all the way. But ladies, you find the first date kiss to be frequently awkward and hard to negotiate too, right? So what’s wrong with taking the work out of things for everyone? I know Max’s Dirty Little Staircase of Love feels awful, but what’s really wrong with it, other than a Rain Manian attention to detail?
I think it’s important to keep moving on a first date. 5 or 6 venues in a single date seems like much more time has gone by that actually has. It’s like 5 or 6 dates worth of memories all in the matter of a few hours. So after the first pint, I’d propose we go somewhere else, which in Milwaukee is code for chug your super alcoholic beer and let’s go do the stairs again. Without wasting any time I’d make my move right at the bottom of the stairs. With that out of the way dates feel more like dates and less like play dates. From there I just keep switching venues and let things progress naturally. All the important barriers have been broken and the way is clear for escalating into a romantic relationship.
And there you have it. The summation of Max’s itinerary for the perfect first date. Get a girl drunk, knock out a few light bulbs, push her down a staircase, then make her some crepes the next morning. Is it evil, or is it organization? Scumbag or sweetheart? OK, sweetheart might be pushing it. But I will submit, although it does make me a little jumbly inside, that I find nothing Max is doing to be wrong or immoral. You could call it manipulative, but I argue it’s just good planning. He’s not tricking a woman into anything, or forcing them into a bad situation, he’s simply doing everything he can to ensure a date succeeds. What bothers me the most is the effort to get his date drunk. It feels dirty, but then again, a sober date is almost never a fun date–so perhaps there is some benevolence even in that? I think what essentially makes this feels slimy is that Max has planned it all out, but lots of people have plan things. Accountants. Travel agents. Mailmen. They’re not dirty. Alright, maybe mailmen are a little dirty. But I think Max’s heart is in the right place, even if is mind is maybe working a bit too hard. What do you think? Is a hero or a villain?
But before you answer, let me say this. Max just let me know that this fall he met a woman online, using these very techniques, and they went crazy for each other. Things got serious fast, and now they live together. With brightly lit, totally stable staircases everywhere. Does that change your mind?
It's Not a Match.com 
I just had the realization that I’ve been a victim of a “Max”. One of the few dates where I ever felt swept off my feet. If interested I wrote about in my own blog where I thought my date was married.
I think five or six places in one night sounds dead exhausting, to be honest, and I know what “Let’s go back to my house/apartment/box in the alley” tends to mean. A little too… forward for me, I suppose, and charmers often make me wonder what they’re hiding. Then again, being polyamorous, I prefer to bring my partner to meet a person for the first time, so charmers are SOL and there will be no going back to anyone’s humble abode until everyone’s ready.
In Milwaukee, there are almost literally 5-6 bars within a few feet of each other in any part of the city. It’s more the cold in the winter you’ll need to navigate.
Before I submit an answer on whether max is a slime all, take age into consideration. If he is young and out in the twenty something dating world I don’t really see much wrong with his actions. A woman can and should decide for herself how much she is going to imbibe and make sure she acts according to what she is looking for. Max does not have the ability to control how someone else acts. That being said, normal decency should preclude Max from taking advantage of someone’s vulnerability.
However, if during the course of the evening it is discovered that his date is not looking to settle into a relationship and has career or other focuses, and all cards being “laid” on the table, I would say his plans are about as calculating as when his date takes two hours to dress, being sure she is properly “groomed” and shaved, they both had the same outcome in mind. Just different methods of planning.
On the other hand if the woman isn’t interested in a quickie, but rather someone with whom a relationship may be pursued, it it is her resposibility to have that clearly stated in her profile file and during various conversations leading up to the date. Then, if Max manipulates the woman into believing that she is greatest thing since sliced bread, then he is a slime.
I chose to get divorced so I could find love and happiness. If I wanted to be manipulated and lonely I’d have stayed married. With that comes my decision to take the men I meet on their word. Yes, that could lend me to complete idiocity, or insanity, but if I go out assuming the worst, then I will never know if he was for real. Those of us with children have precious little time to pursue our own “adult” interests. People like max simply waste our time and money (babysitters). If we met and he started trying to plough drinks into me, and everything was kismet, I’d know right away he wasn’t worth the makeup I used (which doesn’t necessarily mean i would not follow through with both of our “plans” – depending on timing ;).
I’m ashamed to say that once in was free from marriage, I’ve been Max once or twice for the reason. I didn’t feel good about it afterwards, and its very difficult to dodge those phone calls, so I avoid that altogether now. I didn’t lie or not enjoy the guys’ company, but I wasn’t jumping out of the frying pan into the fire. I did make it clear that I was newly divorced and unsure of what I wanted. Though for some reason any single guy over forty and can hold a steady job, thinks he’s the best thing that could come into a divorcee’s life!
So, bottom line, if Max lied to manipulate a woman into bed then he is a slime. If he were confident enough to be honest he may have gotten laid anyway! If too many Max’s cause sheer terror at the thought of trusting or believing in finding love and happiness than he is much better off out of the dating realm (though I question how long his marriage will last. Someone who spent that much time lying and manipulating, may not even know what or who he really is and therefore is unlikely to be giving of his true self.
Pardon the typos idiocy and a few too many “then’s”
Thank you for revitalizing my hope in women. A lot of people tend to forget, the women that fall for “manipulative Max” should be put in the same category with him. Women have the ability to defend themselves from men like this, an there’s no reason they HAVE to be the victim.
At the very least, “diabolical.” There is a part of me that wishes I had this kind of attention to detail…my brain simply does not work like this. The only time I can come close is when I know I am really, really into a girl. So maybe for Max, the biological imperative of accomplishing coitus is so powerful that he can hunt and trap women like a primitve man would hunt animals. It’s a little disturbed, to be sure, that he doesn’t seem to view these women as people. So maybe there is a little bit of sociopathy in the mix, too.
Not a villian. It is a numbers game and he was maximizing his efficiency sorting through the numbers. I think max is brilliant. I want to learn more about Max.
The dilemma I am coming across is the love paradox. The woman wants there to be something to the relationship before she sleeps with the man. The man has no clue if there is a connection until he finds out if there is a connection in bed. Chick or the egg? Sex or relationship? Both paradoxes.
Here in the bible belt many women believe in the 5 date rule. Fuck that. Anything that can be done to shorten the five date rule is smart. Max has a system down that worked for him. He played the numbers game, and it worked out for him. Good for him.
He is still a douche for standing up the girl in the previous article. Other than that I think Max is being a manipulative shit, which is exactly what he should be. Max has the personality that when he does something he does it right, and that was his approach to online dating. Good for him.
My big issue with this guy isn’t the techniques, it’s motivation. If you’re doing all this down-to-the-detail planning because first dates are awkward and you want to make the woman feel as comfortable as possible, cool. If you’re doing it as an elaborate game to have sex with her, that feels sleazy.
I agree. What troubles me about Max’s techniques is that their “success” seems to be determined by a night in bed, not a second date or relationship with a woman.
But…he did meet someone for a relationship, so that must’ve been at least part of his intent, yes?
It always bothers me when people imply that sex as motivation for dating is somehow wrong, but a relationship or marriage for motivation is somehow right. It’s like claiming that the only valid reason to read a book is to learn something. Or it’s wrong to eat food unless it is purely to keep you alive. Sometimes you just want to read for fun, sometimes you just want a slice of chocolate cake, and sometimes you just want to get it on with a date.
Bravo Max for knowing what you want and going after it in a methodical way. And bravo Max again for knowing when to take that good relationship when it came along
Perhaps, but a a book doesn’t have expectations of it’s reader, nor does one usually try to get their food drunk to change its behavior.
“Is he a hero or a villain?” It’s not that clear-cut, I don’t think. (First off, Max: it’s “imminent,” not “eminent.”) The amount of attention-to-detail is admirable, and I’m kind of envious of that. The efficiency of it, too. It must have taken quite a while, and quite a few misses and practice runs, to refine this extensive and detailed process to the degree it clearly has been. Copious notes indeed.
I’m not real impressed with the stated goal, but hey, if it’s a numbers game and you’ve figured out how to maximize your time and minimize your risk in pursuit of that goal, it does make a great deal of sense. Accounting-wise, anyway. Also, it does maximize his dates’ time in that they’re getting the full package right from the start, and can make their decisions accordingly. If he isn’t lying about it, or being intentionally deceptive, I’d have a hard time demonizing him.
Something about it is just borderline predatory, though, and I can’t quite put my finger on it.
It’d be interesting to know if Max has described this detailed methodology to his current relationship partner.
Way too much effort. When someone tries too hard its usually pretty obvious and a turn off for most people. I’d say the awkwardness and uncertainty of a first date is what makes it so great. In my opinion, the best date happens when you don’t over-think it or try much at all and just let things unfold naturally. Max sounds like he’s 22 and trying to sleep with as many women as possible. The fact that he hit it off with someone was a result of numbers, not of his asinine planning.
I just read the article with the girlfriend looking over my shoulder. She’s also read all of my email exchanges with our beloved B and is fully aware about how I went about my online dating business. She enjoyed the article, although she did get a bit defensive for me when reading the comments. Reading about myself I do have to say that I do sound like a creepy predator so I can’t really blame any of you for your comments, in fact I think they were extremely open-minded compared to the comments from the last story about me.
Ironically, all the methods and strategies for online dating that I sent to B that were Max approved are really about making online dating LESS creepy. Because its inherently creepy which is why this web domain even exists. It’s really hard to build a romantic relationship with strangers. I think if everyone acted like me internet dating wouldn’t be something that people resort to or enter into skeptically but rather something that they look forward to because they’ll get some of the best dates of their lives.
Internet dating is a numbers game and your ability to crunch those numbers efficiently is important but what’s really important is to refine your process. You’ve got to be capable of putting together a good experience because the next one could be the one you need it for. Anyone who is reading B’s site and book’s already know this–you care enough to learn and get better so pick through this article like any other and grab the bits that are useful to you. You too, can be an internet dating crepeist.
Ha ha, well said, Max. There is something hopelessly romantic about Internet dating, that you (or I, or anyone reading) would be willing to take continuous shots in the darkness, looking for the perfect match, hoping that the next shot will be the last one you ever have to take. Max treated every girl like she might be that one. I understand why that’s uncomfortable for people, but I think it’s pretty sweet. Did the girls feel the same way? Obviously at least one did, and when you find that one, well, who really cares about all the rest?
Seems sad to me. Very cynical approach to life.
I guess everyone has their hobbies, and self-proclaimed manipulation of women is Max’s – not a healthy or mature trait. Too bad for the women he has seen who see arrogance as the same thing as confidence, but maybe someday both the one (who is supposedly next to him) and Max (and his cheerleaders on here) will either/both grow up and/or grow a conscience.
I just found this site today, and I think Max is brilliant. I’m a guy, and I want him as a life and dating coach.
Schmuck vs. Just a Smart Guy… hmmm, well, if you’re gonna date strangers, some smarts do help… How does one create an authentic, loving, and passionate friendship after all these games though? Does one just “grow up” one day and decide to surrender to cultivating a committable relationship, or does one just continue the gaming with inauthentic marriage (65% divorce rate stats, etc).
I appreciate guys like B and the neo-feminist bro at the website “NiceGuysofOKC” who are forging ahead, come hell or high water, in the uncharted seas of online dating. Snarky reflection, brilliant expose, and creative criticism is so refreshing to the tired masses of online daters who use their brains.
I wonder how The Max Strategy works out in long term relationship – i.e., such type of an alcohol dependency for “good communication” easily builds a habit pattern for non-resolution of conflicts, and future misery (think the nightmare coupled fighting of “Who’s Afraid of Virginia Woolf”). Being that I want the natural high of unintoxicated relationship, I don’t let fellas ply me with drinks. And if a female does go with the drinking baiting, it’s often a very sad thing actually, with many self-destructive and potentially harmful female emotional outcomes the next morning/week/month. Would Max want any woman he respects to go that route? Would he want his future daughter to?
If a man relies on alcohol to procure a compliant or sensually disarrayed woman, is he any better than the man who pays a pro prostitute? No, he’s not – he’s just a Stradlater (Catcher in the Rye).
You’re begging the question. I’m not building relationships out of lies, deceit, and alcohol dependency. I’d say my strategy is more akin to a grand opening of a business. After everything is launched and the promotions expire do the customers “grow up” and surrender their patronage?
The element of Alcohol in a date isn’t about getting someone unconscious or even about impairing judgement–it’s about suppressing fear. Normal social situations have plenty of fear and when you add meeting strangers on the internet to that liquid courage becomes a first date’s best friend. Online dating is supposed to be about expediting love. Alcohol has been doing that long before match or OKC. Perhaps you’d enjoy your dates more if you took responsibility for your own faculties and had a drink.
It says something pretty sad about the guys I date in LA that my reaction to this is only 10% “what a douchebag” and 90% “aww, he actually puts in some effort, how cute!”
My initial disappointment at match.com, its Fisher Price interface and the way it inexplicably fails to indicate who has actually paid for a subscription (and so is serious about dating) has been more than made up for by discovering this hilarious blog!
Max is traversing a tricky line, I think. Bordering on a sleazy scumbag and a harmless guy ignorant to his own scheme. I can’t accurately judge what I think Max as a person is without a specific piece of information: what dating site was he using? There is nothing wrong with expecting a date to end up with sex, without much of an interest in a relationship. Yet, I feel that if a person is on a dating site that you pay for like Match or eHarmony, or even one for free that requires more effort to build an attractive profile like OKCupid, you are most likely looking for a relationship. For those looking to start a relationship, the goal of the first date is not sex, more it’s to meet in person and see how the dynamics of the personalities coexist – to see if you feel chemistry. If the feeling is there and you are both comfortable with the night ending in sex, then that’s OK too.
The problem I have with Max, is he creates a plan with the goal being sex. He isn’t on a dating site looking for a relationship, he’s looking for sex. This isn’t inherently bad, but I seriously doubt his dates are looking for the same thing, or devising a similar plan to get him to sleep with them. This is why he uses alcohol as a medium to loosen inhibitions. If both parties were looking for sex on the first date, it will happen without alcohol. Max’s plan depends on alcohol because he knows these women would not sleep with him on the first date if they had their full wits about them, which leads me to believe that these women present the expectation they are looking for relationships rather than simple hookups. He also uses control to not only display his dominance but instill a sense of submission and insecurity in his dates. If he is in complete control, there is little the date can feel confident about.
He say’s he stood up that one date because he didn’t want her to waste her time, because he knew he was shallow and wouldn’t date her anyway. He fails to realize that he has wasted the time of every one of his dates he actually went on, because he had no initial intention of actually having a relationship with them, just sex, where they most likely wanted to invest their time getting to know someone, so a second and third date would be more special. The fact that he is now with someone he met this way isn’t proof that he was looking for a relationship in every one of these first dates. He got lucky that he found someone with close interests and whom he actually felt chemistry with once he was on the date. The beginning of that date started just like the others though, with the assumption that he would not get what he was after if he did not follow his plan, because there was no way his date would sleep with him sober and confident.
I used OKC. Looking for a relationship and looking for sex are not mutually exclusive. My goal was to expedite every single aspect of building a romantic relationship and sex is one of those aspects. If anything sex helps build a connection. Are you just assuming I never called them afterwards or what?
With descriptions like “dominance,” “submission,” and “insecurity” you clearly think that I was bullying women into sleeping with me. What I cared about was logistics or behind the scenes preparations that my dates never even knew about. If you want to paint me as a predator you’re better off going with the opposite story–that I lulled them into a false sense of security. Of course that’s not true either because nobody was ever in any danger so the security wasn’t false.
I guess what I’m saying is that you’re wrong about everything.
HA! I love Max.
Maybe the article was misleading in your intention of the dates. I said there is nothing wrong with wanting and/or having sex on the first date, however, I think it’s a two way street. I don’t think you were bullying them; from what I read there was no badgering or “negging” going on that would somehow emotionally bully a girl into bed. Sex is an aspect of a relationship, but it’s not a priority for some people – it’s a priority for you. I’m not sure if you called them back or not, the article didn’t elaborate. It is assumed that none of those dates, save for one, resulted in a long term relationship.
One statement that leads me to believe you did have a predatory nature in your dating habits is that you assume control over every aspect of the date. If your date has control over some aspect of the date it may stray away from your goal, so you devise a plan that prevents this. The use of alcohol in your plan is a predatory tactic as well. You even build your plan around, maybe “tricking” your date into drinking more, because if she had control over that aspect, she might not drink as much and this would negatively affect the goal of your date. Your use of alcohol in the date as you had said is intended to help your date loosen up. This “loosening up” is the loss of inhibition; have you ever wondered if your date didn’t want to loosen up? It’s not a rare concept, that no matter the attraction one doesn’t want to have sex on the first date. There are many reasons for this: they have done it in the past and afterwards they have felt cheaper, or they felt they had damaged their values system by jumping into bed with someone on the first meeting, or that they wanted to build up an emotional attachment to someone before pursuing a physical relationship. Just because your date loosened up enough to want to sleep with you later in the night doesn’t mean it’s what they actually wanted, it just means they weakened their inhibitions enough to succumb to their insecurities – I seriously doubt every girl you went on a first date with had the same intentions you did.
You feel the need to defend yourself on an anonymous forum. I may be wrong about everything, but I think a more plausible conclusion is that you are actually afraid to admit you feel like you somehow took advantage of your dates. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think you are a date rapist or anywhere close. I just don’t think you realized that your dates never intended or even wanted to have sex on the first date, and if you did, you certainly didn’t respect their values. After reading some comments, reactions from you and reactions from B, it would appear that you are both enamored with the idea that expecting sex from the first date and devising a plant to maximize that occurance is somehow socially acceptable; that you are both tricking yourselves into believing it’s not your fault women have a negative reaction to this style of dating, rather it’s because they don’t understand your true intentions, or that you are somehow wiser, and they ignorant, to the human’s inherent desires.
Finally, whereas sex is an aspect of building a romantic relationship, it is less significant in a long term relationship. There are two phases to a relationship: compassionate and companionate. The relationship starts off in the compassionate phase, which is when two people fall madly in love with each other, closely bond, are inseperable, and whether it’s upon immediately meeting each other or shortly after, have lots of passionate sex. This phase eventually wanes – sometimes in 6 months, sometimes in 2 years. As it wanes, the companionate phase starts to increase in value. This phase takes the relationship to its term. This is the phase two people start to wonder what it would actually be like to grow old with their partner, if they will still be affectionate towards one another, if they really have enough in common where life will still be interesting and challenging or if they are just getting sick of each other and realized they were just in it for the passion and lust. In this phase, sex is less important an aspect.
I’ll admit that a part of me doesn’t like what Max is doing (particularly the part about trying to get her drunk), but another part of me recognizes that he is just making more efficient use of his first meets.
This article never said that Max’s goal was to score on a first date, it just said that he’s prepared for that event, should it arise. :: shrugs ::
Scumbag/Hero judgment: Difficult to tell.
Ulch. Heh, the quick litmus test for right or wrong is how would you feel if this was happening to your sister or daughter. Nobody wants their daughter or sister to suffer a “Max.” Men speak with disgust of gold-digging women, is there a word for men who do this? Oh wait there is. Many words in fact. Nothing new or original about what Max is doing. Nothing new or different in women succumbing to it. Same old, same old. Stuff of movies since the invention of film. We know how this story will end too…Max gets married, uses clever brain to hide infidelity from wife. Divorce, back on match emailing “hot chicks” and complaining that they don’t give older guys a chance. Ha. Note to Max, -you- deserve better for yourself. You’ve got a clever way to hide feeling vulnerable when you are always in control…but you miss out on that amazing feeling when someone you love comes through for you in amazing ways. Not because you feel you conned them to being your mate. Seriously, best to you and the upcoming fights with will-be wife.
Sounds like brilliance to me. Wish I had this much charisma.
I haven’t read that much in years. Informing and entertaining. Last girl who I liked off a dating site, ended up sending her bf, yes boyfriend, and I a picture stating when she is alone she thinks of us. She messed up by
Making it a group text. I laughed about it till he told me who he was and told me I was a dead man. Ha, well I still decided to meet her and had a great time. Thing is, as you would expect, she wasn’t ready for me, why? Because she isn’t single!!! I, of course, am the better match for her, but I can’t come between a relationship of a year and make way. I am however, still single.
Well, if we’re supposed to stop doing this kind of stuff, women have to stop using padded push up bras. All of them. Let’s see when that’ll happen.
Max isn’t going to be liked here. Women like to think they are the ones doing all the calculating. Men like to think they all have it figured out. His effort and outcome are simply brilliant. I’m guessing he works in a job that requires detailed planning and execution. Finance?
Regardless, We can’t assume that anyone would behave differently in meeting Max or someone like him. Why? Because we don’t have a parallel universe for comparison. In regards to the conversation topic about what if this were your daughter or sister. Well, I’d like for them to have a good time and if they choose to have sex as a result, it’s up to them to make that choice not me. I’m willing to bet that no matter how it worked out for the relationship, he’s probably one of the more memorable dates they’ve ever had.
From what I’ve seen of women, they want to be entertained, made to feel special, and be with someone thoughtful. Is that not what he’s doing? What if the woman went into this with it being 6 months or more since anyone paid real honest attention to her and went out with Max. Is she not entitled to make up her mind on the spot to have a go with him after he has made the effort to have her feel special?
The problem with online dating is simple. Assumption of motive. If women and men could both get over all the background chatter in their heads and reading into every interaction, they’d both have a much better time. And maybe, just maybe, be more successful.